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Willow1

In God We Trust

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Jander, despite popular belief I do not believe that god created America or Canada to be the great countries that they are! I do not trace the histories of our countries back and find god to be a determining factor. It is people like me that would be in the minority but still are entitled to their rights as well! It doesn't anger me when I hear someone mentioning god, every man to himself but when people openly neglect the rights of others by imposing beliefs on others, thats where I draw the line!

 

Donna, here in Alberta we do not say prayers before school. I am in grade 11 ,high school, and never throughout my schooling have I ever had to say prayers for anything. I would do it out of respect for my classmates but I definately do not feel comfortable having beliefs imposed on me. My parents were non-religous also, but told me to believe in what I thought true. Not necissarily the popular belief, but what I believe and I think that is more important than imposing beliefs on today's children on every aspect and not just religion

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sorry, guess I should have said in my neck of the woods the lords prayer is said. I don't see anything wrong with it...I see more wrong with commercials than I do with religion. Maybe we should ban Santa and the Easter Bunny too. :blink: Then again, what do I know. :mrsgreen: well, its cookie time. :oreo:

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Guest Deuces Wild

...every man to himself but when people openly neglect the rights of others by imposing beliefs on others, thats where I draw the line!

 

 

Interesting.....but isn't that exactly what you and others in the minority are doing by not allowing others to keep "Under God" in the pledge, by prohibiting Nativity scenes on city property and by trying to force the Boy Scouts into accepting girls? ;)

 

Are we allowed to draw the line also? :mrgreen:

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Guest Deuces Wild

I understand what you are saying and I dont really dispute it, but

 

 

If you changed that and said Satans prayer, what would everyone be saying then? What would it hurt???

 

 

 

 

So there is a satans *prayer*? :woot:

 

I must have missed that one when I was raised by my parents. ;)

 

Thank God!

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Quite interesting thread. My six year old goes to a catholic school, where before school starts they say a morning prayer and the pledge. Now EVERY time we pass an American flag, and I mean every, he starts reciting the pledge.

 

My oldest went to the same school for 6 years, goes to a public school, and I am not sure he even remembers the words. That is sad, because they don't say it at his school now. But, I and the school had taught him about our country.

I want them to know what a great country we live in. A wonderful melting pot. I'm still amazed though that it hasn't been that long ago, that we had to make a law saying blacks can eat in the same restrauant or use the same restroom or attend the same school. I believe in God, but I don't need to see it on my money or make a pledge. I feel Him in my heart and by the things I do to be more Christ like. I really don't know what the "discussion" is even about. Write it on your envelope or don't. You know in your heart what is right for you

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Guest Deuces Wild

When certain death is staring them in the face (like many of those who died on 9-11) I wonder how many of the non believers find faith and pray to God for forgiveness? I would guess most. ;)

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Deuces Wild

 

Certain things that happen, crystalise the mind into the things that matter.

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Actually, 9-11 is a great example. The hijackers plowed those planes into buildings with the knowledge that God would provide 72 virgins for each of them. They were at peace with their decision. Or were they wrong? Maybe they had the wrong God? I agree with you that fear of death's unknowns drives many people to religion. In their case I think it was not fear, but a clear case of "God is on our side" reinforced to their believers by the fact they got away with it.

 

The government should respect the rights of all its citizens. The more that people ask the govt to do, the more we will run afoul of these issues. Take schools, for instance. People are required by LAW to send their kids to school. There is nothing wrong with a Catholic school starting the day with a prayer. It's a private school. Presumably everyone going there is comfortable with Catholic beliefs. But there are many people who send their kids to public school and can't afford a private school. Is it appropriate to start the day with a prayer? I would say no, because it is a govt-run school. Nobody is preventing your right to pray. If you feel that your child needs a prayer to start the day and you can't afford private school, they can pray before they get to school.

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Volt, you are dead on target.

 

I want to answer some questions with a question: Is Christianity a violent religion? If certain persons would read it, you would find the answers to many questions about what is going on today. For instance, it says that the middle eastern tribes are always going to be at war with one another and Israel...I think Palestine fits the bill. There's so much information in that book that even people who have studied it their entire professional lives are still learning new things.

 

Now, as far as praying in school, because all children don't have the same beliefs, I think there should be a moment of silence every morning- 1 or 2 minutes. Children who pray will pray, those who don't can think or sleep. Everyone's happy.

 

I still want to know how having "In God We Trust" on money and "One Nation Under God" in the pledge forces anything on you and infringes on your conscience and otherwise makes you feel bad.

 

Deuces, we can't draw the line because we're the majority...they couldn't have that ;)

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Is Christianity a violent religion?

Ask those who were persecuted under Hitler. he and his henchmen were all self proclaimed "christians".

 

Religions as a general rule arn't violent,,people are violent.

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Well I can say I'm God, but does that make me God? If it does, let me know cuz there's a few things I want to do :mrgreen: A true Christian is known by his actions, not his words (waxing philisophical here).

 

And no, religions in general are not violent. The only violent ones I have read about as of yet are Islam and Satanism. I'm not trying to push religion on anyone, as I'm not a Christian (although I hold to the beliefs). I do this only because I have carefully reasoned it out. There would have to be a God. There's no getting around it. How else would we come into existance? Although it's hard to believe, some facts are.

 

Even from a non religious point of view, but from a "greedy" point of view, the US as a Christian nation is all pluses. If you trace the US and how Christian pov's changed, you would see that we prospered under the Christian pov. Actaully, it's not even confined to the US.

 

Want a dead on example of what happens without religion? France. Simply put, they didn't base their government on any religion. And it has failed continuously. Our forefathers knew this and made our government the way it is because of that. I can assure you that if they knew how things are going nowadays, they would have made things a little more strict in respects to religion and government.

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Deuces, that site you linked to was GREAT! And the pictures left me breathless! I have never seen such beautiful pictures before!

 

As for this whole discussion, I have but one last thing to say. Since God has started to be phased out of our country, we have have started on an ever-increasing downward spiral in morality! But that can change because the ONE TRUE GOD (like it or not, believe it or not, it doesn't change the fact) has told us, "If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then will I hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and will heal their land." :)

Star, you rock this joint! :rocks:

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I agree with Volt that people are violent and religions are not. However Christianity has plenty of blood on its hands. Apart from the crusades and Hitler what about the inquisition. Years of torture, punishment, death and cleansing of the population to make sure that the population was sufficiently Christian. If you want to compare body counts I think Christianity is the clear winner.

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And no, religions in general are not violent. The only violent ones I have read about as of yet are Islam and Satanism.

I don't know anything about Satanism, but I wouldn't automatically put Islam in the violent category just because it has radicals. The last time the Islamists really had to get radical on someone's butt in a big way was during the Crusades, and the Christians had certainly earned a lot of animosity. Even the Pope has said that there is such as thing as a "just war". Christians are not totally against war, it just has to be for a good cause. I suspect the majority of Islamists feel the same way. All we disagree on, then, is what constitutes a "just war".

 

Here we are, living in some of the wealthiest and least-threatened countries on the face of the earth, trying to judge an entire culture and religion based on what is happening halfway around the world. If your land was occupied, your neighborhood had been hit by a coalition bomb gone astray, or your house had just been knocked over by an Israeli bulldozer, you might feel differently.

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The Crusades were unjust. Catholicism is messed up Christianity. And Islam isn't a peaceful religion. If you read the Torah, you will find that out very quickly. I don't want to give everyone here a history lesson, but I will if I have to just to make my point.

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Posted: Apr 13 2003, 07:39 PM .... by Willow1

 

It appears my post has stirred quite a controversy! This was not my intention! I have no wish or desire to tell anyone to "sit down and shut up", .........................................................

 

Willow1 ........ I bet you never thought your post would go this far ...... I've been lost for some time now ...... but, it's obviously enjoyable for the postee's ...... and what is more important than anything, .......... it represents the freedom of thought and speech that would be appreciated in many, many other countries!.

 

((There's nearly 100 posts here, I would be inclined to keep a copy of it!))

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