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freedom01

Windows Blue

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Desktop operating systems Latest service pack End of mainstream support End of extended support

Windows XP Service Pack 3 April 14, 2009 April 8, 2014

Windows Vista Service Pack 2 April 10, 2012 April 11, 2017

Windows 7 Service Pack 1 January 12, 2015 January 14, 2020

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows/products/lifecycle

Edited by terry1966

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given the cost of the operating system and the license terms users are required to agree to, i definitely think microsoft should provide more for their customers. i just hope it's much less of this metro b.s. and more of the good things about the windows platform.

 

one thing they really need to do is provide a native non-metro interface that is more like the windows 7 interface. what's wrong with choices? are you afraid people will shun metro? i'm sure the answer is yes, but it's still happening against their best efforts.

Edited by badbinary

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given the cost of the operating system and the license terms users are required to agree to, i definitely think microsoft should provide more for their customers. i just hope it's much less of this metro b.s. and more of the good things about the windows platform.one thing they really need to do is provide a native non-metro interface that is more like the windows 7 interface. what's wrong with choices? are you afraid people will shun metro? i'm sure the answer is yes, but it's still happening against their best efforts.

 

You do have a choice BB...don't buy Windows 8.

If you do you can get around metro if you really can't live with it..again you still have a choice. You can make it look like XP, W7 or like me come to actually like the metro concept (maybe not the implementation though!!)..especially when you have a touch screen PC.

The real concern with Windows 8 is the locked down/restricted BIOS - I know there are ways around it, but it's my PC to do what I want with!

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i'm aware of my choice, but that does not change my criticism. i would like to see windows improve, not turn into some clown os that is entirely non-intuitive.

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How does windows lock down your bios...... O.o

 

And when Windows 8 started talking about downloading apps like on your phone, I did a U-turn, lol

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How does windows lock down your bios...... O.o

 

+1 BIOS is on the motherboard so I fail to see how Windows could lock it.....

And that's not all, if that's where Windows is headed...then it's time to brush up better on my SuSE cause we aint going there. That will lose them lots of customers that like to O/C...

 

 

 

 

:geezer:

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Yes Microsoft locks down UEFI Bios so that no other systems can be loaded onto it. No other operating systems can be installed unless Microsoft gives you permission to do it. If you were not aware of this you haven't been following the news. This has been talked about for a long time now and is already being implemented. You can go to just about and Linux forum and find many people finding out the hard way that that shiny new PC/Laptop can't be used for anything other then what Microsoft wants it to be used for.

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to be fair, it's not really anything new in the industry. apple has operated in this fashion for quite some time.

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from what I have read, OEM pc manufactures have windows 8 locked into the bios. When you buy a new pc from Dell, HP, Lenovo...ect. You will not get a COA sticker on the case with the key printed on it because it is in the bios. All you need to do is to install Windows on these pc's and your done. no key installation needed. I have also heard that manufactures are going to give *nix systems access eventually, with some type of key for the bios use.

Now if you have a custom built box with a builder version of windows 8 on it (one that you purchase) , then you get the COA sticker to put on the case because custom built pc's will not have their bios locked to the Windows 8 license. Currently Microsoft does not offer a retail version of Windows 8

 

 

 

 

.

Edited by Joe C

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Ah, so it's just OEM computers that have a factory locked bios. MS isn't actually locking it just from simply installing the o/s. That makes a load more sense.

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from what I have read, OEM pc manufactures have windows 8 locked into the bios. When you buy a new pc from Dell, HP, Lenovo...ect. You will not get a COA sticker on the case with the key printed on it because it is in the bios. All you need to do is to install Windows on these pc's and your done. no key installation needed. I have also heard that manufactures are going to give *nix systems access eventually, with some type of key for the bios use.

Now if you have a custom built box with a builder version of windows 8 on it (one that you purchase) , then you get the COA sticker to put on the case because custom built pc's will not have their bios locked to the Windows 8 license. Currently Microsoft does not offer a retail version of Windows 8

 

 

 

 

.

yes they do

 

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msstore/pd/productID.266514600?WT.term=windows+8&WT.mc_id=pointitsem_Microsoft+US_google_5+-+Windows+8&WT.medium=cpc&WT.campaign=5+-+Windows+8&WT.content=cjlJPBqq&WT.srch=1&WT.source=google&cshift_ck=b548b039-9825-436c-938b-e60ec0c91f7ecscjlJPBqq

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the locked uefi bios depends on architecture, arm devices "will" have to be locked by the oems if they want microsoft certification and to install win 8 on them.x86 devices "should" have the option to disable the uefi bios and use a standard bios, so no lock. linux kernel programmers hate it because1 it's not a security feature, it's a user control feature, and2 it's no more secure than what linux already has in place for security, without locking the bios. "locked" doesn't mean you can not get into it and look around and maybe even change things like ram timings, voltages etc. what "locked" means is that the pc won't load any software for controlling any of the hardware unless it has been signed by a microsoft trusted key. because of this software will not be able to see let alone read/write to any hardware like the hard drive, computer screen via graphics hardware etc. when you try to install an operating system or things like your live cd's. linux have gotten around this feature in a few ways, one was by getting the grub bootloader signed by ms and then using it to pass off the loading of all drivers etc to the linux os. :b33r:

Edited by terry1966

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i wasn't aware software could have an emotion. i guess i was wrong.

what is sight an emotion now then?

i always thought it was the perception of knowing something was there. :laughing:

 

:b33r:

 

oops i now see you meant. "linux hates it because" and not "because of this software will not be able to see let alone read/write" :blush:

 

:rofl3:

 

need to go back and edit that so it says "linux developers" or something. :laughing:

 

:b33r:

 

done. :tup:

 

now says "linux kernel programmers hate it because" :rofl3:

 

:b33r:

Edited by terry1966

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to be fair, it's not really anything new in the industry. apple has operated in this fashion for quite some time.

To be fair Apple makes that hardware! That said I have installed Linux on all kinds of Apple computers very easily.

Microsoft is "requiring" that manufacturers lock the UEFI Bios on windows 8 computers.

 

from what I have read, OEM pc manufactures have windows 8 locked into the bios. When you buy a new pc from Dell, HP, Lenovo...ect. You will not get a COA sticker on the case with the key printed on it because it is in the bios. All you need to do is to install Windows on these pc's and your done. no key installation needed. I have also heard that manufactures are going to give *nix systems access eventually, with some type of key for the bios use.

Now if you have a custom built box with a builder version of windows 8 on it (one that you purchase) , then you get the COA sticker to put on the case because custom built pc's will not have their bios locked to the Windows 8 license. Currently Microsoft does not offer a retail version of Windows 8

 

 

 

 

.

Joe Windows 8 has been for sale for a long time now, in fact it is all you will see in retail stores. Places like New Egg still sell other version but they have had win 8 for a long time

 

http://www.newegg.com/Operating-Systems/SubCategory/ID-368

Edited by Bruce

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apple doesn't make the hardware. they outsource it to other companies like intel, foxxconn, etc...the same companies that make your windows pc components. the difference is that apple goes to the component makers to design and assemple a final product that carries the apple name whereas microsoft relies on middlemen like dell and hp to perform that step.

 

i don't see it as much of a difference when it really comes down to it.

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OK BB, Apple sells the hardware as their brand, they design it, they specify what it will do, what it will look like, and what will be inside it, what will be outside it.............!

 

Microsoft does nothing but sell an OS, and then makes demands on the buyers that they must lock computers so they can only use that OS.

 

There is a huge difference there.

 

One designs everything from the hardware, the case, the OS, and the software.

 

The other makes software and forces other companies to change their hardware to comply with their restrictive requirements.

 

Much the same as you buying a car and a third party dictating to you what engine you can and can not have.

Edited by Bruce

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Enter the DIY segment? I mean 'technically' all users are supposed to read the EULA so they could agree/disagree with this practice and go which direction they would like to. MS isn't doing anything technically shady other than taking advantage of the fact most users don't have a clue what's going on in their box. MS is just selling a product with restrictions as they see fit. Consumers ALWAYS have the choice of saying no to the purchase.

 

But maybe with the metro interface, it'd make it easier for people to look into linux since you'd have to learn new things either way you pick?

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OK so I walk into the store, and wish to read the EULA of a specific computer I might buy. How do I do that before I plunk down my hard earned cash. Is it a small booklet attached somewhere? Perhaps I would like to take it home and read it then come back and make my purchase.

 

How do I make that informed decision, without the agreement before the purchase?

Edited by Bruce

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I don't buy a car, or any other large ticket item that requires a "contract" without seeing a contract first. Why is that I must first spend my money to see the contract and then decide if I want to spend my money when it comes to computers?

 

That is asinine and totally backwards and should be illegal.

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www.microsoft.com/legal/useterms

That does not cover everything, is not provided at the time of purchase, and may not even be relevant to the specific computer I purchase as most have several contracts/agreements aka software, Operating system, hardware manufacturer agreements, copyright and patent agreements..............

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