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Seldom

HJT Certified

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i too dabbled in the HJT classroom way back when radio first posted about it and asked for serious volunteers. ...i believe jaycee was there at the same time.

 

...she's still at it. :tup:

....i didn't last very long. :lol:

 

wasn't because it was the most difficult thing to learn....i think most with a good working knowledge of windows can figure out a HJT log and "fix" it correctly.

 

...but weeding thru HJT logs is far too boring and time consuming for my tastes. :yucky: ....hats off to those who take the time to do it. :clap:

 

though i'll admit i was pretty peed-off when this whole "trusted HJT" crap started and i got a friendly pm telling me not to post there anymore. :(

 

i'll quote badbinary here 'cause it pretty much sums up how i feel....

 

 

:beer:

 

similar situation for me, except that my PM was more like a cease and desist letter. After I continued to help the person through PM's I was promptly banned for a week, I believe it was a week give or take a day or two. I've signed up for the course and started it but then had a revelation and determined that if they don't want me there then I just won't go there anymore, I've been back since to see how many unanswered posts there are but nothing more then that.

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cpuguru, you were put in 'timeout' for 72 hours....you need to get together with Salo35 to discuss which one of you, you are....he said the same thing.

 

The beginning of this topic 'Seldom' posted that I said "the classrooms were full". Indeed they are! Once again, I never said they were not "accepting".

 

These wonderful classrooms are full......full of people who think they want to know all about HJT to help other people. The reality is...they don't want to follow through with the training involved because they don't have enough computer knowledge to even identify an IP# or they think it's ludicrous (possibly embarrassing?) to jump through the hoops (as it's called) to continue. Some are so extremely arrogant that they don't come back, or are just removed from the classroom altogether.

This is a time waster for the teachers who are giving up there time to help teach when they could be helping a person with a sick computer.

 

I get pm's from time to time about joining a HJT classroom. I can usually tell who will waste a forum's time by joining and not following the instructions given to new trainees. I sometimes have to weigh the situation and why they are asking for the links. I know that I personally have wasted many precious hours trying to train those who simply know how to copy and paste a 'fix'....that doesn't even pertain to the particular infection! :pullhair:

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Posted Image

I just happen to like this flag so I used it.

Now just imagine it's completely white.

 

A white flag of surrender.

 

Holy cow people...if you want to spend all your time

helping people that willingly go onto sites that reak

havoc on their computers then do the required training

to do so.

 

Why drag the Pit into the gutter.

This site seems pretty sound to me.

 

I'm not commenting on thread closures,

I'm strictly saying that anyone wanting to

post in the HJT forum need only pass the

basic requirements.

 

I'm glad the same is not true in user to user or

the OC forum or anywhere else.

Big deal..a group set themselve's apart

for the greater good of all...personnally I

don't have the time.

 

I can stay out of there..no problem..I don't take it personnally.

Why are some of you?

Just curious.

 

Viva La Pit

Edited by Humbluemoon

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Jacee,

 

I believe many of us understand the frustration of helping people who simply can't follow instructions, or the even more frustrating task of helping someone will not follow instructions. I run into it on a regular basis, folks who get to certain steps, don't understand what to do, so they skip the steps and then don't understand why things don't work correctly. I don't see it as a waste of time, just that people are more difficult to work with then computers are. :lol:

 

Computers for me are logical devices, that do what they are told to do (most of the time) people however are very often illogical, stubborn and in general difficult to work with.

 

I too run into people who can't even identify an IP number, or can't distinguish which numbers represent which part of their system. Again an extremely difficult situation, especially when trying to help them with a completely new operating system :lol: Still I don't consider it a waste of my time.

 

I also on a regular basis work with folks who don't like jumping through certain hoops to accomplish things, I don't write them off, I try to be patient ( not an easy thing for me) and leave them to their own devices until they come around, I don't see this as a waste of time either.

 

I get tons of PM's about using new operating systems. I have a canned response for 99% of those PM's. I do not offer help via PM's. we have an "open forum" form getting help. The ones who are truly interested go to the forums and post a question or numerous questions. The ones who are not interested don't.

 

I have spent countless hours helping folks, who never return, who just can't come to grips with what they are being told, who are so set in their ways that they can't do things differently, or who are just simply yanking my chain. I don't consider it a waste of my time.

 

I don't consider any of it a waste of time, because the time I offer I offer freely, and do it because I want to.

 

I too can usually tell pretty quickly who is determined enough to keep plugging away and determined enough to finish what they start, or who really has a desire. I make recommendations based on what I gather from what the person wants to do and what they expect. Sometimes I tell them I don't think they will be happy with or won't be able to accomplish what they want with their current skills.

 

Some folks say thanks and take the advice, some are upset with it, and some say they want to do it anyways, when that is the case I do my best to get them going. Most often those folks find exactly what I said was true, and end up not following through. I don't consider it a waste of my time.

 

I simply do the best that I can, and let the chips fall where they may. My time was not wasted, because I didn't loose anything, only they did, so it is they who wasted their time.

 

I completely understand your frustration, I believe most of us do. But it's never a waste of time. ;)

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cpuguru, you were put in 'timeout' for 72 hours....you need to get together with Salo35 to discuss which one of you, you are....he said the same thing.

 

The beginning of this topic 'Seldom' posted that I said "the classrooms were full". Indeed they are! Once again, I never said they were not "accepting".

 

These wonderful classrooms are full......full of people who think they want to know all about HJT to help other people. The reality is...they don't want to follow through with the training involved because they don't have enough computer knowledge to even identify an IP# or they think it's ludicrous (possibly embarrassing?) to jump through the hoops (as it's called) to continue. Some are so extremely arrogant that they don't come back, or are just removed from the classroom altogether.

This is a time waster for the teachers who are giving up there time to help teach when they could be helping a person with a sick computer.

 

I get pm's from time to time about joining a HJT classroom. I can usually tell who will waste a forum's time by joining and not following the instructions given to new trainees. I sometimes have to weigh the situation and why they are asking for the links. I know that I personally have wasted many precious hours trying to train those who simply know how to copy and paste a 'fix'....that doesn't even pertain to the particular infection! :pullhair:

 

we were both helping the same person by PM, Salo35 stopped PMing him back while I continued despite being warned... Salo35 was temporarily banned by association and nothing more. I was surprised as anyone that Salo35 was temporarily banned since he did nothing wrong, he obeyed your warning and was temporarily banned nonetheless. By the way, if a person requests help through a PM with regards to a HJT log then I think that non-trusted HJT advisors should be able to help without fear of being temporarily banned.

 

"you need to get together with Salo35 to discuss which one of you, you are....he said the same thing" I am guessing that you mean by that sentence (the grammar made it extremely confusing) "since you and salo35 had a similar story, you need to determine which person you are". We were both helping people in the HJT forum it just so happens we were helping the same person by PM when I got a warning from you. I figured that since I wasn't posting in the HJT forum, only to respond to a thank you from a person I had helped, that I was still able to PM the person I was helping. I was unable to log on for 72 hours, it felt like longer being away from my pit family for so long, and in that time the person me and salo35 were helping had left the site permanently. I was unable to check my PM's to understand why I was in 'timeout'.

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you need to get together with Salo35 to discuss which one of you, you are

 

 

 

 

Clutch the pearls, what a sneaky thing to do. Guess it makes it a lot easier to find someone who shares your viewpoint though. :P Thats OK but if they disagree I'll get concerned. :lol:

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Insane that anyone could be banned for helping another member via PM. Simply blows my mind. :mrsgreen:

 

Personal messages are just that, personal messages.

 

I have never once seen a rule anywhere in these forums that says it is against the rules to post in any forum, but banning people for private communications with other members is about as lame as it gets.

 

I had no idea that people were being banned for using personal messaging. :nono::mrsgreen:

 

The only banable offense concerning personal messages are threats! That is the only reason such an action can be taken.

 

I simply am amazed.....no actually I am shocked that such a thing ever was even considered, the fact that it was done is nothing short of wayyyyyyy out of line and an abuse of privacy and an abuse of power.

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Guys... Hate to sound like a grown up and all, but rules are rules, they are part of life and this ain't a democracy and you don't run or pay for the servers they are providing this service on!

 

I would hate to manage most of you. "oh I don't like that rule so I'll break it!, and just b__tch if I get caught! Come on!! Grow up!!! If you really want to help people suck it up and take the lessons. If you just want to be arrogant a---es then you have already reached the pinnacle of success!!!!

 

I have been temporarily banned for not following the rules... MY BAD!!! Not theirs!!!! If you don't like it... go away and let the rest of us have fun...

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Your right, the rules are the rules, and they apply to everyone.

 

That said, please get and show me the rule where it says a member can be banned for helping someone in a personal message, when done doing that get and show me a rule where it says a member can be banned for posting in a forum, for that matter get and show me a rule where it says a member can not post in a certain forum.

 

Been around here a very long time now, long before the ban happy people in positions of power now, and know the rules pretty well. I should considering I am the one who wrote the rough draft that are the rules you see here in the forums today.

 

The only and I do mean the only rule that says anything about banning a member concerns "any member who threatens anyone on the forum, via PM, instant messengers, or Email, will be banned immediately without notice."

 

The rules were well thought out, and for many years the ban was used very sparingly, and almost never. Other then threats and personal attacks on other members such a thing should never even be a consideration.

 

The fact that such a thing was done concerning personal messages is not only unacceptable, but just simply way out of line.

 

I had no idea such a thing was happening, and to be quite honest if I had I would have raised holy hell about it.

 

Now that I am aware of it, that is just what I will be doing.

Edited by Bruce

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I had no idea such a thing was happening, and to be quite honest if I had I would have raised holy hell about it.

 

Now that I am aware of it, that is just what I will be doing.

 

 

'ya just gotta love this guy folks! :clap:

 

:cheers:

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Your right, the rules are the rules, and they apply to everyone.

 

That said, please get and show me the rule where it says a member can be banned for helping someone in a personal message, when done doing that get and show me a rule where it says a member can be banned for posting in a forum, for that matter get and show me a rule where it says a member can not post in a certain forum.

 

Been around here a very long time now, long before the ban happy people in positions of power now, and know the rules pretty well. I should considering I am the one who wrote the rough draft that are the rules you see here in the forums today.

 

The only and I do mean the only rule that says anything about banning a member concerns "any member who threatens anyone on the forum, via PM, instant messengers, or Email, will be banned immediately without notice."

 

The rules were well thought out, and for many years the ban was used very sparingly, and almost never. Other then threats and personal attacks on other members such a thing should never even be a consideration.

 

The fact that such a thing was done concerning personal messages is not only unacceptable, but just simply way out of line.

 

I had no idea such a thing was happening, and to be quite honest if I had I would have raised holy hell about it.

 

Now that I am aware of it, that is just what I will be doing.

 

 

Well that assumes that Private Message means private from moderators etc... That it does not... I have run into this on other forums and it is pretty much the same everywhere. Things said in private are only private from the general viewing public. Otherwise much harm can be done on PC Pitstop Servers, and believe or not they can be held liable for it. So they have no choice but to monitor.

 

Besides, not knowing the whole story it appears that the two involved knew they weren't supposed to post the advice and were simply trying to bypass the rules. They got caught, their wrists slapped, and they are none the worse for wear. Don't press the boundaries unless your willing to take the consequenses of pusing them too far.

Edited by indafog

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Private means "private" that is the way it is and always has been.

 

It disgusts me that this has happened.

 

There is no "rule" that was broken, not in any way shape or form.

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No one was banned :rolleyes: The person who was given advice pm'd me to tell me they were being p'md by a non HJT advisor.

 

A 'timeout' was called for on account of the arguments (via pm) that this fiasco caused. AND, the challenge that was given to me via the pm's. It's in the boardroom records and it was agreed upon the time out/cool down session.

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Well the argument would have never ensued, if imaginary non existant rules were not being enforced.

 

Unless cpu or Salo were threatening, or otherwise harrassing this individual then it is in no way shape or form a violation of any rule. Or are the rules just being made up as we go along now?

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Well I got alot of the "filtered" word stuff from the pm's cpu sent me, so I put him in timeout for not following the rules and arguing with me.

 

He got 72 hours for his crap to me. I don't know what else could have been expected by him, but I won't and no one else should take pm's with that kind of garbage.

 

It offended me and as I posted it in the boardroom, it was a clear decision to put him in a cool down position.

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'ya just gotta love this guy folks! :clap:

 

:cheers:

 

I do... and one day I will get brave and try out all those linux cds he sent me all in a really nice cd case (made duplicates for my brother also in a cd case) along with complete instructions as well as a way to contact him if I needed help. He did all this of his own accord and paid for shipping too. Bruce has an incredible amount of knowledge and I have nothing but respect for him always. :tup:

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Well I got alot of the "filtered" word stuff from the pm's cpu sent me, so I put him in timeout for not following the rules and arguing with me.

 

He got 72 hours for his crap to me. I don't know what else could have been expected by him, but I won't and no one else should take pm's with that kind of garbage.

 

It offended me and as I posted it in the boardroom, it was a clear decision to put him in a cool down position.

 

Maybe I was angry because I was in trouble for helping a person through PM, I don't have the PM's that I sent you or that you sent me but I still stand by everything I said and do not apologize for anything. It is horrible that anyone can be punished for helping a person in private.

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It is horrible that anyone can be punished for helping a person in private.

The key is its not private to the staff. The person you helped squealed on you. They did not mean you any harm but it happend anyway.

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This whole "HJT Certified" business slipped in under everyone's noses in my mind.

 

I was always under the impression that "HJT certified" was put into place to put more emphasis on the advice given from such members. To use another analogy, it is like weightlifting or dieting under unofficial accord. There are risks but you can achieve results without professional advice.

 

HJT certified members should not be the end all to everyone's malware problems....losing out on lots of helpful advice there.

 

To offer another view, why not develop an online traffic schoolesque class here at the pit? No need to waste the precious teacher's time, as everything would be automated and ensure that a member knows the information.

Edited by ChrisR

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cpuguru, you were put in 'timeout' for 72 hours....you need to get together with Salo35 to discuss which one of you, you are....he said the same thing.

If your implying that were the same person you are sadly mistaken

Edited by Salo35

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I understand all sides of this discussion. I gave up a long time ago on the notion of helping fight spyware on the fourm. If I won the lottery and did not have to be a single Dad I would have the time to get the education to help. In the mean time I am content to do the same thing locally and pay thr rent. Getting the education is important because it gives you the ability to do this at a distance without the users computer right in front of you. I belive the members here that are trying to help are very good at doing this with the computer right in front of them, But that is a very different story when all you have to work with is logs and scans.

 

I do my best to instruct my customers on how they got thier computers messed up in the first place. I preach about ActiveX,P2P,Free stuff, E-mail and IM threats. I take the time before I clean the computer to show them what programs were most likely to have brought them to me in the first place.

 

I lurk around several fourms and keep up with all the tools( Thanks to all the advisors who create the tools) and have them on my pen drive at all times. These other fourms all have the same rules about HJT logs and have had the same discussion going on as well.

 

How about someone post some links to some other fourms where there are no restrictions and people can go create a traceable track record of sucessful help. That might be an alternatve to the battle here.

 

Also just want also give Kudos to all the helpers who do this freely on this and other fourms. :beer:

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